4221. In order that I might know that such is the case, I have been permitted to speak with those who have lived in this manner, and likewise with one with whom I had been acquainted in the life of the body. During this man's life on earth, all the good he had done to the neighbor had been done for the sake of himself, that is, for his own honor and gain. All who could not be made subservient to these ends he had despised, and even hated. He had indeed made an oral confession of God, but at heart acknowledged Him not; and when I was permitted to speak to him there exhaled from him a sphere that was as it were corporeal. His speech was not like that of spirits, but was like that of a mortal still in the flesh; for the speech of spirits is distinguished from that of men in being full of ideas, or in having within it something spiritual, thus something alive that is inexpressible; but this was not the case with this man's speech. Such was the sphere that exhaled from him and that was perceived in everything that he said. He appeared there among the vile; and I was told that persons of this character successively become so gross and stupid in respect to their thoughts and affections, that no one in this world is more so. They have their abode under the buttocks, where their hell is. From the same place there had previously appeared a certain person (not as a spirit, but as a grossly corporeal man, appears), in whom there was so little of the life of intelligence which is properly human, that you would call it stupidity personified. From these examples it was evident what kind of spirits those become who are in no love toward the neighbor, nor toward the state, and still less toward the Lord's kingdom; but who are exclusively in the love of self, and who in everything regard themselves alone, even adoring themselves as gods, and also desiring to be so adored by others, and having this intent in everything they do.