4221. To enable me to know that this is so I have been allowed to talk to those who have lived in this manner and also to one person whom I had even known during his lifetime. Whatever good he had done to the neighbour during that time he had done for selfish reasons, that is to say, for the sake of his own position and gain. The rest to whom he did not do good he treated with contempt and also hated. He did, it is true, confess God with the lips, but he did not acknowledge Him in his heart. When I was allowed to talk to him there emanated from him a sphere which was so to speak of a bodily and unspiritual nature. His speech was not like that of spirits but of people still living in this world - for the speech of spirits differs from that of men in that it is filled with ideas, that is, it incorporates something spiritual and so a living quality that cannot be described. But the speech of the spirit to whom I spoke was not like this. The sphere emanating from him and which was perceptible in every single thing he said was such as mentioned above. He was to be seen there among those who are base, and I was told that such people gradually become in their thoughts and affections so dull and stupid that no one on earth could be more stupid than they are. They have a place under the buttocks where their hell is situated. From there one had also appeared previously who did not look like a spirit but an extremely bodily-minded man in whom the life of intelligence which is truly human was so minimal that you would call it the embodiment of stupidity. These experiences showed me what kind of spirits those people become who have no love for their neighbour, nor any for the general public, still less any for the Lord's kingdom, but who love only themselves and consider only themselves in every single thing, indeed who adore themselves as gods and also wish to be so adored by others, having this intent in everything they do.