5513. 'And we said to him, We are upright men; we are not spies' means a denial that they were interested in truths for the sake of gain. This is clear from the meaning of 'saying to him' as a reply, in this case a denial; from the meaning of 'we are upright men' as having an interest in truths which are indeed truths, dealt with in 5434, 5437, 5460; and from the meaning of 'spies' as those interested in the truths known to the Church for the sake of gain. Here it is denied that gain was the reason for their interest in them.