2877. A DISCOURSE WITH SPIRITS THAT INTERIORS WHICH DO NOT APPEAR TO THEM, ARE EVERYTHING. Certain deceitful spirits when it was written concerning the representative Church, that there were only externals whereby holy internal things were represented; he said that he could not understand these things, although he was able to understand; but it was given to reply to him by ideas and spiritual and visual representations, that what we see, are only envelopes and outermost coverings, when there are interiors which are the all thereof. It was granted to represent to him a tree whose leaves only appear, then an apple, of which we see only the outside, when yet within it are fibers like trees, if they are unfolded: there are juices purer and purer, there are envelopes of seeds, there are seeds which inwardly store up the purest [principles] thereof: these we do not see. Such is his thought, only a certain external cuticle skin. - 1748, August 21.